Is Tesla doomed? (23 Nov, 2017)

Have your say on today's Aardvark Daily column

Re: Is Tesla doomed? (23 Nov, 2017)

Postby Malcolm » Thu Nov 23, 2017 2:43 pm

I don't think they ever released the Leaf new here in NZ. Which means if you want to buy parts you can't buy form Nissan NZ directly as they don't support them. Apparently we are getting the next gen model available officially however.
Malcolm
 
Posts: 217
Joined: Thu May 08, 2014 9:43 am

Re: Is Tesla doomed? (23 Nov, 2017)

Postby ffirman » Thu Nov 23, 2017 2:58 pm

We get really bitten for prices here for ev's in general.

Taking the US prices as examples..

The new 2018 Leaf $30K
Tesla 3 (when we can get one) $35K starting price.
Bolt $37.5K
Hyundai Ionic $29.5K

Where here the Ionic is $60K... Which is a lot more than the exchange rate etc would suggest it should be.

As an example, a few car yards are looking at buying new EV's from the UK and shipping them here, as they can do that cheaper than what the local dealers can do. And they are also trying to get use of the local tax breaks as well, to drop the price even further, if possible.

So the 2018 Leaf I've heard could be had new for $44k here and the Zoe 40Kw version for about 40K here.

Now for Tesla, I hope they are able to pull off the Tesla 3 and get their manufacturing up to the rate that they want to do, as it would give the existing car manufactures a good push along, as they have really been coasting for a long time now.

F.
ffirman
 
Posts: 26
Joined: Wed May 07, 2014 8:29 pm

Re: Is Tesla doomed? (23 Nov, 2017)

Postby psycik » Thu Nov 23, 2017 2:59 pm

paulw wrote:In NZ the Nissan Leaf was a bomb. Too expensive at about $65 grand new , hardly sold any. Where that have boomed here in the Jap and UK second hand import models from about $13 to 40 grand. New EVs are still way too expense here for the average car buyer. Maybe the Tesler company like it's name sake will die a penniless bankrupt.


The EV proponents will argue that even though theyre higher to purposed over their life they're cheaper. But screw paying $60k for a car that would be $20k as an ICE (tilda vs leaf)
psycik
 
Posts: 33
Joined: Fri May 09, 2014 7:44 am

Re: Is Tesla doomed? (23 Nov, 2017)

Postby ffirman » Thu Nov 23, 2017 3:12 pm

I have a leaf, and I also would have had a really hard time justifying it, if it had been 60K... esp with the max range of about 140km. But as a 12K 2nd hand import, that provides for most of our travel it was an easy decision.

Even the current Hyundai Ioniq at 60K and a 180-200Km range, is still too much, I think.. 35-40K would be more acceptable, I feel.

If the Bolt was available in RHD and here, with a range of about 360Km it becomes a much better option as basically an everyday car.

Now Bruce, figure out the BMS on the Leafs, and how to clone / emulate the protocol from the BMS to the computer, and create your own battery to replace the existing one. Maybe increase the storage volume as well, and I think you would have people lined up at your door step.. Depending on price of course.

But as an example.. 2nd hand car from Japan with degraded battery, $10K. New larger battery that provides 250km range (40KWh) $8kUS => 12K NZ (Approx), so with profit say 30K all up, and it would prob be a goer.

F.
ffirman
 
Posts: 26
Joined: Wed May 07, 2014 8:29 pm

Re: Is Tesla doomed? (23 Nov, 2017)

Postby phill » Thu Nov 23, 2017 3:14 pm

psycik wrote:
paulw wrote:In NZ the Nissan Leaf was a bomb. Too expensive at about $65 grand new , hardly sold any. Where that have boomed here in the Jap and UK second hand import models from about $13 to 40 grand. New EVs are still way too expense here for the average car buyer. Maybe the Tesler company like it's name sake will die a penniless bankrupt.


The EV proponents will argue that even though theyre higher to purposed over their life they're cheaper. But screw paying $60k for a car that would be $20k as an ICE (tilda vs leaf)



this is a major and you will not be the only one

they need to find a better way to amortize the battery cost
( ,,,,,,,, ....... A E I O U use em sparingly theres probably not enough )
User avatar
phill
 
Posts: 1278
Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2014 8:31 pm

Re: Is Tesla doomed? (23 Nov, 2017)

Postby aardvark_admin » Thu Nov 23, 2017 3:24 pm

This is why I think we (as a nation) should look at indigenous EV development.

Making a much lighter EV (as some have suggested) would significantly reduce the battery capacity needed and perhaps even offering a "commuter-level" economy battery which is good for say 100Km might enable the total package price to be brought down significantly -- whilst also creating jobs and potential export earnings right here in Godzone.

Opt for the "extended" battery at a higher cost and then the vehicle becomes suitable for modest trips away (say 250Km) which might meet the needs of quite a few regular Kiwis who go to the beach for a summer holiday.

Of course the problem is that every man and his dog has their investment funds locked up in residential property right now so there just isn't the VC to fund such a venture. A tragic testament to the distorted shape of our economy.
aardvark_admin
Site Admin
 
Posts: 2727
Joined: Wed May 07, 2014 2:10 pm

Re: Is Tesla doomed? (23 Nov, 2017)

Postby phill » Thu Nov 23, 2017 4:05 pm

100 k is fine for me
even does my usual required range to town and back ( 80ks ) its also fine for when im in the city and every job i have had in auckland and most in sydney would be covered ( both ways )


i prefer the reev option for anything outside my normal range where in 5 mins i can install a 100% alcohol burning computer controlled with the gps trip meter linked in ice generator to cover it

and i will keep harping on ... "get the f..ing weight down!!" ... hence even the small generator is removable
Last edited by phill on Thu Nov 23, 2017 5:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
( ,,,,,,,, ....... A E I O U use em sparingly theres probably not enough )
User avatar
phill
 
Posts: 1278
Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2014 8:31 pm

Re: Is Tesla doomed? (23 Nov, 2017)

Postby psycik » Thu Nov 23, 2017 4:27 pm

100k as in distance, or $100k in that you’re happy to pay that?
psycik
 
Posts: 33
Joined: Fri May 09, 2014 7:44 am

Re: Is Tesla doomed? (23 Nov, 2017)

Postby phill » Thu Nov 23, 2017 5:17 pm

psycik wrote:100k as in distance, or $100k in that you’re happy to pay that?


*GASP*
kilometers :o

part of the benefit of getting the weight down will be getting the cost down ( in manufacturing most things weight is proportional to cost )
less weight = less materials and greater range
less materials = less cost

and with the batteries adding so much to the final weight making their requirement smaller / lighter is a double plus
and imltho .. where tesla ( and most of the others ) are screwing up big time
( ,,,,,,,, ....... A E I O U use em sparingly theres probably not enough )
User avatar
phill
 
Posts: 1278
Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2014 8:31 pm

Re: Is Tesla doomed? (23 Nov, 2017)

Postby Malcolm » Fri Nov 24, 2017 7:27 am

phill wrote:
psycik wrote:100k as in distance, or $100k in that you’re happy to pay that?

part of the benefit of getting the weight down will be getting the cost down ( in manufacturing most things weight is proportional to cost )
less weight = less materials and greater range
less materials = less cost


Less weight probably means using more exotic/expensive materials. E.G Carbon fibre body instead of aluminium or steel. So while you shave 100KG you spent 3x as much.
Malcolm
 
Posts: 217
Joined: Thu May 08, 2014 9:43 am

PreviousNext

Return to Today's column

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 2 guests

cron