Criminals breaking the law? No! (25 Jun, 2020)

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Criminals breaking the law? No! (25 Jun, 2020)

Postby aardvark_admin » Thu Jun 25, 2020 6:38 am

This column is archived at: https://aardvark.co.nz/daily/2020/0625.shtml

How fair is it that hundreds of thousands of recreational shooters have their hobby and their sport gutted simply because the police failed to do their job properly?

Is anyone really naive enough to expect that criminals and organised criminal gangs were going to hand in their AK47s just because they've been deemed to be an illegal firearm now?

Was anyone surprised to find that these weapons are still in the hands of (and being used by) bad guys for committing crimes?

What have we gained by removing yet another freedom from innocent, hard-working, responsible Kiwis?

But hey, we can't blame the police -- that would be "a witch hunt" in the PM's own parlance and those in the employ of the state must never be held responsible for their failings :-(
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Re: Criminals breaking the law? No! (25 Jun, 2020)

Postby phill » Thu Jun 25, 2020 10:01 am

it doesn't take much searching to realise that
armed criminals follow the arming of police trend

the only group that gets left behind are the public
shop keepers facing more armed robberies from criminals
and more of the public shot as collateral damage by police

they cannot stop drugs coming in that have trained dogs and staff specially kitted out to prevent it
there is no chance they can stop some bits of steel coming in that can be assembled into any sort of weapon

like with the covid response .. things can be made to sound completely under control but if the groundwork isn't done properly
things are still custard waiting to happen
( ,,,,,,,, ....... A E I O U use em sparingly theres probably not enough )

i might live and eat in a sewer .. but hey look how many of these shiny things i have got
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Re: Criminals breaking the law? No! (25 Jun, 2020)

Postby aardvark_admin » Thu Jun 25, 2020 10:21 am

I can see why the conspiracy nuts get so much following these days:

Big brother significantly restricts the availability of guns to the people
Big brother severely restricts the use of drones by the people
Big brother usurps citzens' rights (state of emergency) using CV19 as justification
Big brother allows police confiscation of assets without even needing to lay charges
Big brother demands "back doors" to encrypted apps and devices
Etc, etc, etc.

Perhaps we should have cherished the 1960s and 1970s as the era of true freedom, never to be seen again in our lifetimes?
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Re: Criminals breaking the law? No! (25 Jun, 2020)

Postby Malcolm » Thu Jun 25, 2020 10:33 am

No one ever believed that unless they were extremely naive. What it does do is reduce the supply of such weapons so over time the amount circulating in the underground will drop. It also gives the authorities more options and opportunities to catch and prosecute those holding these firearms. The fact that the firearms laws weren't fit for purpose and several attempts to tidy them up since the early 90s have always been blocked by the shooter's lobby groups. It took a tragedy like Christchurch to force change through.
I think as recently as 2014 there was a bill to introduce a new category of license for semi automatics. This was in response to a shooting incident in the far north. this was held up and quietly dropped thanks to lobbying organised by the owner of Gun City.
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Re: Criminals breaking the law? No! (25 Jun, 2020)

Postby phill » Thu Jun 25, 2020 10:35 am

still getting a 404 on the daily post site ... not yet posted by following the long route
( ,,,,,,,, ....... A E I O U use em sparingly theres probably not enough )

i might live and eat in a sewer .. but hey look how many of these shiny things i have got
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Re: Criminals breaking the law? No! (25 Jun, 2020)

Postby aardvark_admin » Thu Jun 25, 2020 10:47 am

phill wrote:still getting a 404 on the daily post site ... not yet posted by following the long route

Now that's freaky... either I'm going insane... or the hosting company did a covert restore between the time I uploaded the column and the time I posted in the forum.

Hmmm... I've (re)uploaded so the link should work now.
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Re: Criminals breaking the law? No! (25 Jun, 2020)

Postby phill » Thu Jun 25, 2020 11:10 am

Malcolm wrote:I think as recently as 2014 there was a bill to introduce a new category of license for semi automatics. This was in response to a shooting incident in the far north. this was held up and quietly dropped thanks to lobbying organised by the owner of Gun City.


those like the new ones are not built on is
they are built on what if's

there are many uses and therefore reasons to have a semi automatic
pest destruction is far more efficient with a semi than with a bolt action

most of our pests are cat size or less
.22 - .25's rimfire's are very good for that size
so exempt that range and type from semi auto legislation

.177-.25 pneumatic ( PCP) air rifles are good enough for rat sized and less .. they have very good accuracy
they hit just as hard as the best spring air rifles .. but are now classed as licence required firearms .. with all the restrictions that that brings in .. so much for aiding a pest free nz

it would seem very few of the press who write about firearms, or the politicians who write the legislation, have ever fired a full auto or even a semi auto to know what they can or cannot do

centre fire rifles in semi auto have a great deal of use for larger pests and magnitudes cheaper to use per animal when factoring in the cost of a helicopter

some of the erroneous reasons given include .. semi's can be made into automatics .. well yes .. but at the range they are anywhere near accurate a shot gun is far more effective ( deadly )
semi's allow people to shoot many times in a small amount of time .. its one way to mass kill .. there are plenty of other ways to do more destruction quietly ( cool aid anyone )
or less quietly .. ( diesel and ammonium nitrate )
are they quick to use .. well yes .. but most mass shooting are planned for quite some time beforehand .. about the same time as it would take to get a large supply of chemicals

do we have reasons for having large centre fire semi's .. yes
how do we secure them
if your that worried organise for these to be kept in a police armoury and taken out as needed with names, dates, place and reasons for use

the only thing for sure is .. the arguments are not as simple as some people think they are
Last edited by phill on Thu Jun 25, 2020 11:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
( ,,,,,,,, ....... A E I O U use em sparingly theres probably not enough )

i might live and eat in a sewer .. but hey look how many of these shiny things i have got
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Re: Criminals breaking the law? No! (25 Jun, 2020)

Postby phill » Thu Jun 25, 2020 11:11 am

aardvark_admin wrote:
phill wrote:still getting a 404 on the daily post site ... not yet posted by following the long route

Now that's freaky... either I'm going insane... or the hosting company did a covert restore between the time I uploaded the column and the time I posted in the forum.

Hmmm... I've (re)uploaded so the link should work now.


i had to sign in again so maybe it was a purge
( ,,,,,,,, ....... A E I O U use em sparingly theres probably not enough )

i might live and eat in a sewer .. but hey look how many of these shiny things i have got
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Re: Criminals breaking the law? No! (25 Jun, 2020)

Postby hagfish » Thu Jun 25, 2020 11:19 am

I think this is one of those cases where everyone has a valid point, and everyone is right:
- Penalising law-abiding gun owners was a gross infringement on our rights; AND:
- I don't miss the rifles whose only purpose was killing people. Yes, they were also great for bowling a mob of goats, but that's because a goat has a similar format to a person.

It's harder to make the case for banning 15-round .22 magazines, but - oh well - I handed mine in (for $100 each! cha-CHING!) and will get some 10-round mags if I ever need to.

It takes a while to drain a swamp, but a dam at one end and a drain at the other is a good start. I expect the man who killed that police officer will receive a sentence that will be fairly 'sobering' for any other Ned Kelly wannabes.
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Re: Criminals breaking the law? No! (25 Jun, 2020)

Postby GSVNoFixedAbode » Thu Jun 25, 2020 11:47 am

What hagfish said. In addition, making those semi-autos illegal is another hook the police now have to arrest/disarm the gangs as & when they can uncover them. I'm comfortable with that.
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