What am I missing here? (21 Oct, 2021)

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Re: What am I missing here? (21 Oct, 2021)

Postby aardvark_admin » Thu Oct 21, 2021 12:12 pm

Norm wrote:Is someone who's in hospital because they've been a heavy drinker and heavy smoker all their life more deserving than someone who's in hospital because they chose to not get vaccinated? It's not obvious to me that they are.

I have reason to believe that heavy smokers/drinkers etc are already subjected to a somewhat second-tier service from our health service.

When I presented with two hernias a few years ago my doctor said I'd probably die before I got the surgery needed to correct them because the list was very long. However, when I was "evaluated" by another doctor I had my surgery within a few weeks. It seems that because I was fit, a non-smoker, not a heavy drinker and not overweight I was given priority over those who might have been any or all of the above. Lower risk, less chance of complications, quicker recovery (in/out time) and such, may have meant that by prioritising cases in this way, more surgeries could be completed in the time allowed and thus the list would get shorter more quickly -- who knows.

All I know is that when I rolled up to the ward where the hernia patients were waiting for surgery, there wasn't a fat person in sight and none of those I spoke to were smokers.

Maybe there's already some kind of (unspoken) existing system that deprioritises the elective surgery of those who choose not to take care of themselves.
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Re: What am I missing here? (21 Oct, 2021)

Postby Malcolm » Thu Oct 21, 2021 2:30 pm

aardvark_admin wrote:
paulw wrote:Let's vaccinate everyone who wants to be and open up. Sick of all this level 3 and 2 BS.

Totally agree... as I've said earlier, just set a date and tell everyone that if they're not vaccinated by then well too bad, it was your choice.

Many medical experts are saying that exposure to the virus once you're vaccinated will significantly improve your immunity so we need to get back to normal ASAP before those who were vaccinated early have lost too much of their protection.

All reports indicate about a 95% protection against hospitalisation once you're vaccinated so I doubt the hospital system would be overloaded if we all took our responsibilities seriously and got the vaccine. Perhaps those who choose not to be vaccinated can be allocated a bed or two within the system and once those are full... well too bad because other, more responsible citizens have a priority for life-saving medical care because they didn't choose to make themselves vulnerable to the virus.


The trouble with that idea is that, well if people could be trusted to be responsible we would have had this outbreak dealt with by now. Instead it has kept spreading among people who think if they just pop in and visit their mates house it won't be a problem. Is it really a coincidence that we get our first triple digit new cases about 5 days after Mortlock and Tamaki held their super-spreader picnic? These people are keeping the virus alive and circulating in the population and making it more likely for a new variant or break-though infection hitting those who have been vaccinated.
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Re: What am I missing here? (21 Oct, 2021)

Postby hagfish » Thu Oct 21, 2021 3:04 pm

In what we like to call a parliamentary democracy, there's a large element of cat-herding. It's a delicate job - in imprecise science. Some people will hold the line indefinitely, and other people last a few weeks, but then can't even be bothered maintaining a two-metre distance at the supermarket. We have the population we have. We our have our social organisation, government and enforcement. So it's a matter of being realistic.

Of course the govt had to let covid into NZ last year - there's no way we would have accepted a hard border, otherwise. Many of us were horrified that we allowed it in, but some of us had to be shown the knife. Oh well.

Every day Auckland can hang on is another day that the rest of us get to enjoy relative freedom, and a few more people can get their inoculations. The handbrake is slipping, and I'm not looking forward to the day that it fails.
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Re: What am I missing here? (21 Oct, 2021)

Postby A Bradford » Thu Oct 21, 2021 4:46 pm

“Perhaps those who choose not to be vaccinated can be allocated a bed or two within the system and once those are full... well too bad because other, more responsible citizens have a priority for life-saving medical care because they didn't choose to make themselves vulnerable to the virus.” Bruce.

Bruce, I’d just like to pull-you-up on just this one thing. Did you hear yourself when you wrote this or was it still a bit early in the morning? Yesterday you said “It's my belief that people are people, regardless of their colour, ethnicity, race or religion” yet only one day later you have said, without any ambiguity, that those with the wrong opinions should be singled out and discriminated against, without mercy. (It’s amazing just how brutal caring can be). Your solution is to divide us into the clean and the unclean. Two distinct and differently treated (literally) classes? However, I'm sure I have probably taken it out of context. Anyway, here is an interesting recent article on the topic regarding the vaccine by a doctor “The Unvaccinated Are Looking Smarter Every Week” By Thomas T. Siler, M.D. (16 Oct) as food for thought.

This respiratory infection is not fatal to those of working age and barely noticeable in children and teenagers; most of these people are not carrying comorbidities. Infected children and teenagers when asymptomatic are not infectious, they aren’t spluttering and don’t have the viral load in the throat and sinuses and so don't create a ‘noxious’ aerosol. If symptomatic, then isolate and treat. When they grow up, they will never be bothered by it again, except they will, of course, have to pay for this mess. So, what else can we do, well, I say improve the currently inadequate hospital system and treat all who need treating, not because they have a “right” but because it is the compassionate thing to do.

As for the politicians, well, let’s just say that their inconsistency (and lies) aids in their grab for power. The technique requires that we, the punters, comply with their inconsistency (and lies) and it has the effect of degrading our probity. It works. And if we are forced to repeat the lies – the more outrageous the better – then that is mightily powerful at reducing our probity and we can easily be led by the nose to slaughter.

As a side issue, keep an eye out for this article being published in a day or two (20 Oct), I for one cannot wait to get into it, I am expecting it to be a very robust and informative article.
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Re: What am I missing here? (21 Oct, 2021)

Postby phill » Thu Oct 21, 2021 5:43 pm

this is so cool
an almost endless link to wack job conspiracy theorists parading at this point as pandemic gurus
i for one am truly thankful to get my daily rendition of someone's last dose of acid inspired dreams
cheers and beers
many thanks
" wack jobs rule ... boooyahhh !!! "
( ,,,,,,,, ....... A E I O U use em sparingly theres probably not enough )

i might live and eat in a sewer .. but hey look how many of these shiny things i have got
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Re: What am I missing here? (21 Oct, 2021)

Postby GCSBIntercepts » Thu Oct 21, 2021 7:53 pm

And the number of specialist ICU / HDU staff that are quitting and not taking the vaccine is?

The number of nursing staff quitting?
Even the humble midwifery staff?


Medicine is toxic. Many are getting out.

Reading the comments here I have a bit of a giggle

You don't prioritise whom gets medical care.

We do.


And given how Woke things are at the moment, you are about to see what happens when Stupid runs your healthcare system.
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Re: What am I missing here? (21 Oct, 2021)

Postby phill » Thu Oct 21, 2021 10:23 pm

turns out the wack job membership criteria isn't intelligence driven
so at a rough guess around 5% wack jobs .. about the same as the rest of the population
( ,,,,,,,, ....... A E I O U use em sparingly theres probably not enough )

i might live and eat in a sewer .. but hey look how many of these shiny things i have got
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Re: What am I missing here? (21 Oct, 2021)

Postby Billybangleballs » Fri Oct 22, 2021 4:42 am

New Zealand are trying to out-compete Boris and his bunch of ne'er-do-wells, the headline today is that the UK is winning.
https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-case-rates-among-schoolchildren-in-england-hit-new-record-high-latest-figures-show-12440324
So you guys will need to work hard before you can become Great like Great Britain.
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Re: What am I missing here? (21 Oct, 2021)

Postby GCSBIntercepts » Fri Oct 22, 2021 9:10 am

So reading the thread here,

Those that intentionally took an experimental vaccine with unknown safety criteria for a low risk disease in line with the common cold don't have any responsibility?

If you took an experimental vaccine, and turn up in an ICU, from a number of vaccine induced conditions, then why should you be given medical care?

You took a vaccine that will actually put you there. Figures.

If you don't like the logic - then you shouldn't victimize those that did the research, waited, and decided that the vaccine was a giant fuck up.

That's what idiots do.
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Re: What am I missing here? (21 Oct, 2021)

Postby phill » Fri Oct 22, 2021 10:28 am

GCSBIntercepts wrote:So reading the thread here,

.


so you dont normally read something before replying ... hmmm
whoda thunked


as for the rest
im not seeing the common cold on the list
https://www.healthsystemtracker.org/bri ... gust-2021/
( ,,,,,,,, ....... A E I O U use em sparingly theres probably not enough )

i might live and eat in a sewer .. but hey look how many of these shiny things i have got
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