Wait for the victims (16 Apr, 2021)

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Wait for the victims (16 Apr, 2021)

Postby aardvark_admin » Fri Apr 16, 2021 7:33 am

This column is archived at: https://aardvark.co.nz/daily/2021/0416.shtml

Is any kind of restriction or price-hike on tobacco now a form of racism?

Will we see the professional victims flooding out of the woodwork to cry foul over the government's new plans to eradicate smoking?

Or have we reached the point where society as a whole (even most smokers) appreciate that we can no longer sustain the damage to our health (with resulting economic impact on the health system) that smoking produces?

Where is this going do you think?

Will smoking soon become a luxury only able to be enjoyed by the old and wealthy?
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Re: Wait for the victims (16 Apr, 2021)

Postby hagfish » Fri Apr 16, 2021 8:50 am

Tobacco thrives over here. If I were ever to take up a pipe, I'd have no problem keeping it stoked with shag. It's a bit like home-brew beer - for the price of a dozen stubbies of ferret's piss, I can boil the kettle and get 23 litres of something delicious underway. The minimal inconvenience of having to tend a pot-plant seems to be sufficient to get people to spend about $100(!!!!) on a 50g pouch.

I don't think this ban is an economic consideration - smokers contribute at least 3x the cost of their eventual health crisis/early death - let alone their pensions.

I'm pretty keen to see an outright ban on private sale of fireworks. Cigarettes is way further down the list. They don't really affect me at all, other than occasionally having to brave the cloud of smoke outside the hospital/courthouse. Indeed, I feel like a bit of a fraud venturing an opinion at all. I'll save it for when they come after my whisky.
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Re: Wait for the victims (16 Apr, 2021)

Postby Malcolm » Fri Apr 16, 2021 9:28 am

Just ban cigarettes, allow people to grow up to two plants for personal use, allow the sale of pipe tobacco and cigars.
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Re: Wait for the victims (16 Apr, 2021)

Postby goosemoose » Fri Apr 16, 2021 10:47 am

No, daft idea. Black market tobacco. Gangs etc. You all know it's going to happen. When the supply of something many people enjoy is restricted or criminalised and there's money to be made you know what will follow.

I'd go the exact opposite, the Portugal model. Everything is legal and it's now a health issue. Mind you it would affect the cops as they'd have not much to do as most drug crime would disappear - not people affected by drugs crime but everything on the sale and supply side of it.

I'll have the odd one on special occasions, especially with a beer or two. In fact banning alcohol should go hand in hand with banning smoking as the 2 go together rather nicely and one often leads to the other. Social smokers in other words - I can count on one hand the number of full time smokers I know, yet social smokers, I don't have enough fingers and toes in the entire town where I live to count the ones I know!

hagfish wrote:I'm pretty keen to see an outright ban on private sale of fireworks

I'm not. I quite enjoy them. If they did get banned we'd have to start up National Molotov Cocktail Day to celebrate the enjoyment of making and using them :twisted:

hagfish wrote:I'll save it for when they come after my whisky.

First they came for my tobacco........
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Re: Wait for the victims (16 Apr, 2021)

Postby phill » Fri Apr 16, 2021 12:28 pm

the usual lack of understanding or thought is once more coming into policies

vaping is the gateway out of smoking .. it's an addiction .. and unlike the heroin / methadone swap .. there is a clear difference in the health consequences between them
how do i know this ... years of research and am now vaping only
all the surface health indicators swing to the positive side once you start vaping ( lung capacity , airway efficiency , and stopping the cough )

on cost alone it's a no brainer
~ $200-$300 setup costs ( depending on what and how many types you buy )
yearly replacement and running cost of hardware is less than $100
oil is $50-$300 per year
so maybe $300-400 for the first year

even at worst it takes less than a month to amortise the cost of the gear and start costing <$0.50 a day

opposing is the cost of smoking
thats pretty easy ~$25 a day x 365 = $9,125 per year

the big problem for most is the requirement for a stronger throat hit when drinking
that gets less with time vaping and can be greatly mitigated by what vaping gear you have and knowledge of how to alter it when required

costings used are a bit mehh
as i re purpose cordless packs for the 18650 batteries .. so cost of those becomes 0
the mods i brought have lasted over 4 years
i buy my oil 4 litres at a time from china for $30 a ltr not including freight
( ,,,,,,,, ....... A E I O U use em sparingly theres probably not enough )

i might live and eat in a sewer .. but hey look how many of these shiny things i have got
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Re: Wait for the victims (16 Apr, 2021)

Postby Perry » Sun Apr 18, 2021 1:52 pm

Quite a few valid points made, but one seems to need more emphasis.

Consequences and who bears them? And the cost.

Of course, the bleeding hearts, hand-wringers, social workers, do-gooders and socialists will scream blue-bloody-murder.

Smoking-caused lung cancer is the fault of the tobacco companies, they will cry; the advertising agencies; the capitalist profit-before-people evil; the nasty, uncaring silver-spoon lot, etc.

Never, never is it the fault of the person who makes a bad choice.

So . . . .

Wanna some cheap, low-taxed smokes - sign here. Whazzat?

A declaration that social security does not cover smoking related illness, disease or death.

You what?
Last edited by Perry on Sun Apr 18, 2021 5:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Wait for the victims (16 Apr, 2021)

Postby phill » Sun Apr 18, 2021 2:01 pm

errr
lets not forget
it's an addiction
and most are addicted before they start ... which means long before they can legally make an informed choice
for me it was long journeys in a ford prefect with the windows up and 2 smokers in front
i was a regular smoker by age 12
and advertising targeting was in those days at the younger than 16 year olds

really really old people were smoking and still looked ok
some were even over 40 years old
( ,,,,,,,, ....... A E I O U use em sparingly theres probably not enough )

i might live and eat in a sewer .. but hey look how many of these shiny things i have got
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Re: Wait for the victims (16 Apr, 2021)

Postby aardvark_admin » Sun Apr 18, 2021 2:43 pm

phill wrote:errr
lets not forget
it's an addiction
and most are addicted before they start ... which means long before they can legally make an informed choice

I disagree.

I was born into a household of smokers. I was also of a generation where it was cool to smoke so many, many of my school-mates started smoking long before they were legally allowed to, usually by stealing from their parents' supply of cigarettes.

Those long car journeys trapped in a vehicle where both the adults were smoking like trains should perhaps have given me an addiction by way of second-hand smoke inhalation but the awful memory of the stench trumped any chemical dependency that may have been brewing.

In my case, I made a very conscious decision not to smoke. I didn't like the smell, I didn't want the addiction and health-problems associated with it and I have never really been a victim of peer pressure. My kids have been bought up with the mantra "be leader not a follower, an opinion-maker not a slave to the opinions of others".

I don't know why *I* was different to my peers but I was. Mind you, I also got 98% in my science exams and 84% in math... so maybe it's that I was just smarter than them :-)
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Re: Wait for the victims (16 Apr, 2021)

Postby phill » Sun Apr 18, 2021 2:52 pm

you may be genetically non disposed to nicotine addiction ( it;s a thing )
the car may also be one that had air con or air vents
or maybe you sat behind the driver who had the window open to some degree
it might be interesting to find out EXACTLY why you were not addicted at an early age
but
im not that interested in doing it
( ,,,,,,,, ....... A E I O U use em sparingly theres probably not enough )

i might live and eat in a sewer .. but hey look how many of these shiny things i have got
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