Pragmatism or principles? (19 Nov, 2021)

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Pragmatism or principles? (19 Nov, 2021)

Postby aardvark_admin » Fri Nov 19, 2021 6:34 am

This column is archived at:

The state has no business knowing who someone is if that person chooses to remain private and anonymous whilst going about their lawful activities.

Anyone who gives up such freedoms for "convenience" betrays the principles that brave men have given their lives for in the wars of last century.

I for one will not betray the memory of those men and I will reserve my right to privacy and anonymity.

This is hardly a pragmatic approach but I honestly believe that a man without principles is not a man at all but merely the servant of a higher power.

Mock me relentlessly for my opinion and stand on this matter but I will not be endangering anyone and my position will disadvantage only myself. At least I will sleep straight at night, not having betrayed the principles by which I live my life.
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Re: Pragmatism or principles? (19 Nov, 2021)

Postby granada29 » Fri Nov 19, 2021 7:00 am

I'm with you on this one Bruce. Like you, I have had 2 shots but also see this passport as the beginning of 'papers please' across a wide range of activities and government requirements for an extended period.

Given that it is clear that the vaccine offers only a modicum of protection after 6 months, the requirements for keeping the papers current will mean getting a new shot at regular intervals. Will this also be extended to cover seasonal flu? I can guess that many employers would love that.

Do you remember the fuss a couple of decades back when a national identity card was proposed? What better way to get one accepted than by the fear mongering and class separation being instituted by this government.

I don't think history will look too kindly on Ardern, Hipkins et al.
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Re: Pragmatism or principles? (19 Nov, 2021)

Postby GSVNoFixedAbode » Fri Nov 19, 2021 7:36 am

I'm in the opposite camp for pragmatic reasons, and (probably foolishly) optimistic regards the feared State Tracking. I'm already fully vaxxed, and about to apply for a certificate (travelling from mainland to Akld next month).
When I headed to the Philippines about 6 years ago on a work trip, I had to get a series of vaccines, and have a vaccine passport signed by the local Dr's practice that administered them before I was allowed to travel and enter the region. I see the current situation internally much the same: internal rather than just external.

Longer term international travel will require vaccination certificates of some form as they have in the past. Internally, I'm predicting that once Covid changes from Pandemic to endemic then these won't be athing any more. The tools will be there for new variants when they arise, but life will eventually settle back to handliung Covid like the flu: yearly vaccinations, and the odd variant sweeping as a pandemic every decade or 5.
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Re: Pragmatism or principles? (19 Nov, 2021)

Postby hagfish » Fri Nov 19, 2021 8:02 am

I'm ambivalent about it, too. It's a shame that vaccination has to be mandated. In a perfect world (that is, a perfect world that happens to have deadly viruses); everyone would line up for a safe, free vaccine that's been shown to be very helpful. But Ms Wellness Woo and Mr RoganFan listened to one too many podcasts, the Saved listened to one too many sermons, and here we are. These groups have demonstrated that they are willing to believe in 'higher powers' (the Spirit, the Deep State, the Big Guy Himself) and seem unwilling to accept that it's really just people like us running about doing their best. So it's Covid for Christmas, because [reasons].
aardvark_admin wrote:Anyone who gives up such freedoms for "convenience"

Those 'freedoms' have been illusory for decades. And I would suggest that thousands of Covid cases will be very 'inconvenient' indeed. We're going to find out, and soon.
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Re: Pragmatism or principles? (19 Nov, 2021)

Postby Perry » Fri Nov 19, 2021 10:09 am

If it's "papers please" that we're headed towards, what everyone's 'take' on the end objective?

I imagine we've all seen most of the conspiracy theories, but I'm still of the view that it's unwise to attribute to conspiracy, that which can be ascribed to stupidity. But I do wonder if the socio-commie-insurrectionists of our era may have learned a thing or two, in recent decades?

Doubtless G-Intercepts will have a view for us. :twisted:

Stepping away from such things and dealing with information that seems to be factual, I've noticed Medsafe finally admitting that - even after both doses - the fizzer GMO compound won't stop a 'vaccinee' catching Covid OR infecting others.

And Air Apartheid should be studying their navels after this:
STUFFed wrote:One person in Christchurch has also tested positive for the virus but will be added to Thursday’s numbers. Officials said there was a clear link to the Auckland cluster in this case. The person had flown back to Christchurch on flight NZ 1295 on Saturday, November 13, after travelling to Auckland for a tangi, Director-General of Health Dr Ashley Bloomfield said. The person became symptomatic on Sunday and went for a test on Monday. Bloomfield said they were fully vaccinated. Passengers on flight NZ1295 are advised to monitor for symptoms for the next 10 days and get a test immediately.

My knowledge of biology is limited, but the empty-headed idea that NZ could build a wall anywhere to keep something like a virus organism in or out shows that a lot of people who should know better know less than I do.

It's called evolution, folks. (Mutation, if you prefer.) It happens in Nature, all the time. Human beings live 'in Nature.' Learning to live with it seems a more prudent approach.
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Re: Pragmatism or principles? (19 Nov, 2021)

Postby aardvark_admin » Fri Nov 19, 2021 10:16 am

Can you imagine how the would would dissolve into chaos if it was discovered that the mRNA vaccines resulted in some kind of unforseen side-effect (such as a 75% chance of developing an fatal auto-immune disorder after a couple of years).

This is, of course, incredibly unlikely but could you imagine how many would die, not from the side-effects, but from the overt and intollerable smugness of the anti-vaxers :-)
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Re: Pragmatism or principles? (19 Nov, 2021)

Postby Perry » Fri Nov 19, 2021 10:24 am

I don't see it as fair, nor reasonable to somehow / anyhow connect all anti-vaxxers with pro-freedomers.

That's the stuff of the NZ gummint's main propaganda organs: the mudstream pravda presstitutes.
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Re: Pragmatism or principles? (19 Nov, 2021)

Postby phord » Fri Nov 19, 2021 11:08 am

The other day, I realized that privacy and anonymity is impossible now.
I am not on Facebook, and never have been.

I setup a FB account for SOMEONE ELSE using the Chrome Incognito window.
I entered my mobile number to activate more features.
FB only sent me an activation code through SMS.

FB then suggested an extensive list of people to connect to, some who I have known for the last 20 years.
This is NOT my FB account, and does NOT have my name in the details.

WTF, how did this happen?
I have NEVER installed the FB app on my phone.

Then I realized, some people who have my mobile number on their phones have shared their contact list with FB.
I've had an identity with FB all this time and I never knew it.

Mark Zuckerberg said in 2019:
"Today we're going to talk about building a privacy-focused social platform. Privacy gives us the freedom to be ourselves, that's why I believe that the future is private."
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Re: Pragmatism or principles? (19 Nov, 2021)

Postby phill » Fri Nov 19, 2021 11:56 am

first mistake . using a phone number
i had about 5 accounts when fb went public
terminated them all at that point .. none had my real name
for family reasons it became advantageous to start another
different name .. throw away email address no correct phone number

as for the vaxx passport .. wont be applying unless / until i need to use one for something far more major than a coffee or drink
( ,,,,,,,, ....... A E I O U use em sparingly theres probably not enough )

i might live and eat in a sewer .. but hey look how many of these shiny things i have got
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Re: Pragmatism or principles? (19 Nov, 2021)

Postby AnTFax » Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:07 pm

By way of analogy. When transport is optimized for self-driving vehicles, for safety reasons any moving thing with a potential of interacting with that car will need to broadcast its location and size near continuously. Clearly passive sensory systems are to slow/fault prone, whereas active systems provide immediate and accurate information. "I am a truck, XX long by XX wide, and I am STOPPED at..." Vehicles which do not have this capability must be prohibited from accessing this network.

ID2020 has made no secret of its alliance's intention to "leverage immunization as an opportunity to establish digital identity".
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